Sorry in advance for the long post. I have several real work issues I would like you to address, please.
#1) HOSTING and MOVING to CLIENT SERVER.
If we are hosting an app for a client and they want to upgrade and install it using your runtime on there equipment. How do we get the data from this one business space off the shared host onto the clients machine?
#2) UNDERLYING DATABASE IS NOT THE PROBLEM.
You make a lot of reference to the underlying database but you create files that are some type of control files that are undocumented and are necessary to run Aware. The MAJOR issue comes into play when we don't have a clue what these files do or how they are used. If we have a systems issue we don't even know the direction to move in. When you run a 24 hours operation and depend on large amount of data that rely on AwareIM and a file or app gets corrupted, this creates our major issue. This isn't an underlying database issue, we can copy/move and do anything we want with those files but one or two small files you use and don't document will keep Aware from running and our entire corporation at a stand still, and that is unacceptable. Please document these files and how they are used.
#3) SIMPLY EXPORT/IMPORT within AwareIM.
I still believe there should be a way to export and import a file (regardless of the underlying database) to and from a BS's without loosing the references links. If we are EXPORTING and IMPORTING all the files it shouldn't be an issue. Name me a development app that can't read and write its own data and put it back. Its a very basic process.
#4) BACKUP LIVE DATA and PUT IT IN A TEST LOCATION
Something developers do all the time is take the last good backup and move it to a test area to do development. This appears to be impossible with the current version of AwareIM.
a) We can't even take existing data and export it and re import it into the quote unquote TEST space because of the linkage problem.
b) There is NO WAY to use even the "UNDERLYING DATABASE" to backup and restore into the TEST area. Because you use different names in the test area for files.
How can anyone do real testing without screwing up the main database if you don't give us the ability to move stuff around. A simple export data and import would work. We don't care about speed, we just need it to do our work.
#5) PARTIAL FILE CORRUPTION?
I have a App in Aware that we talked about in another thread that goes into what appears to be a loop and then dumps with a internal error. I've put that same app in TEST mode and created all the same transactions and it doesn't crash. So I'm assuming the problem is most likely in one of the two files the process is using. Which at this point are new files without much data that I could dump if AwareIM would recreate them. Basic stability should be built into AwareIM. If a table gets corrupted or removed AwareIM should give the developer the ability to recreate that table without crashing the complete development environment and the app.
Sorry again, for the long post but these are major concerns of ours, before we go live. And thank you in advance for your time answering it.
Transfer or Backup/Restore a single Business Space
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aware_support
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1) As we said before the utility that would export/import all operational data is in our development plans. In the meantime you can get around this problem using mysqldump utility. You can backup all system tables and all tables from the business space in question and then restore them on the client side. See also this thread http://www.awareim.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=797
2) If you start fiddling with the system at the database table level and start moving database files around you are likely to cause major issues for yourselves (and for us as you will be asking us to help you). Every system has certain undocumented internal stuff that it needs for its proper operation. A corruption can happen with any database at any time. The solution for this is to use regular backups. If you do need urgent help in certain emergency situations - you can purchase our premium support and we will do our best to sort out these emergencies.
3) Yes, it's in our plans (see item 1) . You can also use mysqldump for this.
4) You can use mysqldump utility to backup your environment and copy it to a separate place for testing. Again see the thread quoted in 1)
5) You need to find out what's going on with your rules and why they go into a loop and error. There were some recommendations to you in the corresponding thread. I'm not sure what this issue has to do with database tables, stability etc and what are the files you are referring to. If you are implying that we should let people re-create database tables manually, then we strongly disagree. If Aware IM corrupts certain tables (which I very much doubt) this is a bug and we will fix it ASAP, but we won't let users fiddle with database tables. I suspect, however, that this problem has nothing to do with table corruption but a problem with rules (or maybe a bug with their execution).
2) If you start fiddling with the system at the database table level and start moving database files around you are likely to cause major issues for yourselves (and for us as you will be asking us to help you). Every system has certain undocumented internal stuff that it needs for its proper operation. A corruption can happen with any database at any time. The solution for this is to use regular backups. If you do need urgent help in certain emergency situations - you can purchase our premium support and we will do our best to sort out these emergencies.
3) Yes, it's in our plans (see item 1) . You can also use mysqldump for this.
4) You can use mysqldump utility to backup your environment and copy it to a separate place for testing. Again see the thread quoted in 1)
5) You need to find out what's going on with your rules and why they go into a loop and error. There were some recommendations to you in the corresponding thread. I'm not sure what this issue has to do with database tables, stability etc and what are the files you are referring to. If you are implying that we should let people re-create database tables manually, then we strongly disagree. If Aware IM corrupts certain tables (which I very much doubt) this is a bug and we will fix it ASAP, but we won't let users fiddle with database tables. I suspect, however, that this problem has nothing to do with table corruption but a problem with rules (or maybe a bug with their execution).
Aware IM Support Team
#1) I understand that something may be in the works but the thread was months ago and I didn't believe it was addressing ONE business space out of several on a hosted site. Did I misread it?
#2) I'm not suggesting that anyone including myself starts fiddling with the database. We are all very happy that your handling it. But being in the computer business for more years than we care to talk about we both know that a full recovery from backup is not always the solution. Sometimes a crash can be a simple fix if you have a little BASIC knowledge of the workings. If its 2am on a Monday morning and the entire office is at a stand still waiting for you to fix somthing by 8am, and your job is on the line. Information at hand is a good thing.
#3) Any expected time frame for this. I believe it would solve our issue if it will allow for a single BS to be exported and restored to a NEW BS on the same or different server.
#4) So if I place data in a single BS (example: The CRM test app) and do an mysqldump I can load it back into files in the TEST directory without any issues?
#5) With some additional debug information I may be able to agree with you. But with the lack of it, its more of a trial and error trying to figure it out. It is a basic rule set I believe, then being new I could be doing something wrong. I've emailed the rules to support, if you could take a look at it and advise, please. As for me, I'm down to pulling my hair out.
Thanks
#2) I'm not suggesting that anyone including myself starts fiddling with the database. We are all very happy that your handling it. But being in the computer business for more years than we care to talk about we both know that a full recovery from backup is not always the solution. Sometimes a crash can be a simple fix if you have a little BASIC knowledge of the workings. If its 2am on a Monday morning and the entire office is at a stand still waiting for you to fix somthing by 8am, and your job is on the line. Information at hand is a good thing.
#3) Any expected time frame for this. I believe it would solve our issue if it will allow for a single BS to be exported and restored to a NEW BS on the same or different server.
#4) So if I place data in a single BS (example: The CRM test app) and do an mysqldump I can load it back into files in the TEST directory without any issues?
#5) With some additional debug information I may be able to agree with you. But with the lack of it, its more of a trial and error trying to figure it out. It is a basic rule set I believe, then being new I could be doing something wrong. I've emailed the rules to support, if you could take a look at it and advise, please. As for me, I'm down to pulling my hair out.
Thanks
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aware_support
- Posts: 7525
- Joined: Sun Apr 24, 2005 12:36 am
- Contact:
1) The thread was about exporting/importing one busines space
2) Please e-mail us specifically what you want us to explain and we will provide the info to you if we can
3) This is currently scheduled for the next version (probably end of the year)
4) The simplest approach would be to backup everything and transfer it to a different place, but you can also back up one business space
5) We received your e-mail and sent you a request for more information as the data you provided is not enough for us to understand what's going on
2) Please e-mail us specifically what you want us to explain and we will provide the info to you if we can
3) This is currently scheduled for the next version (probably end of the year)
4) The simplest approach would be to backup everything and transfer it to a different place, but you can also back up one business space
5) We received your e-mail and sent you a request for more information as the data you provided is not enough for us to understand what's going on
Aware IM Support Team